dashlet Posted September 10, 2022 (edited) Liminal Doom its a set of 7 moody boom maps made on pair with my friend @Lhyntel We took a session watching a lot of those liminal spaces images and saving the ones which we find more interesting to recreate inside Doom. Some of the layouts are NOT IDENTICAL to the original images because we wanted to give them our own personal take (Some areas are not based on images at all). To make sure the maps felt liminal (at least for us), we playtested the maps a lot without monsters, this way we focused a lot in trying to archive that weird feeling when looking at some of these images. All the maps were designed to be pistol started. Difficulty settings are also implemented. HMP Recommended Ultra-Violence can be challenging at some points, so i suggest using lower difficulties if that's bothering you. On HMP and HNTR you will play the same maps, with the same encounters and progression, but with less punishment (The lower the difficulty, the more you can concentrate on the visuals/atmosphere). Play with no monsters for a more liminal experience The maps were tested using DSDA Doom. DOWNLOAD: https://www.doomworld.com/idgames/levels/doom2/Ports/j-l/ldoom Screenshots: (All of them were taken with -nomonsters parameter and software renderer) Spoiler Resources used: Recolored Doom textures by NiGHTMARE Extra credits can be found on readme Edited September 28, 2023 by dashlet 62 Share this post Link to post
fai1025 Posted September 10, 2022 I'm suprised that there's no Backroom reference in there (or maybe there was, I just don't know yet) 1 Share this post Link to post
sandwedge Posted September 11, 2022 This looks really cool. Some of Never by Tei Tenga had a bit of this vibe and I really liked it there. It seems like an ambitious project to take on as an intro to doom mapping, though the liminal theme might actually help since they are not overly detailed places. Cool concept basing them on pictures as well. Looking forward to it! 4 Share this post Link to post
Casketkrusher Posted September 11, 2022 That looks really good, especially for a beginner! 1 Share this post Link to post
dashlet Posted September 12, 2022 (edited) Thank you all for the comments and reactions! We didnt expect people to see the post that quickly. Anyways as a gift i have today for you some screenshots of the map im currently working on. This are some very early sneak peaks, but im already proud of what i got so far. Spoiler Hope you like them! Edited October 2, 2022 by dashlet 3 Share this post Link to post
dashlet Posted September 14, 2022 (edited) Hello everybody! I have good news for you: today you'll be able to download and play the first map of the wad from start to finish! After some polish and little changes i decided to publish this version which also comes with the menu and stats screen respectibly. The map can be play on different difficulties and was tested primary using PrBoom Plus and DSDA Doom (complevel 9), but it should work fine on GZDoom too. For the best experience i recommend using software renderer, but its optional. If you got any feedback after playing then please let me know! All additional credits can be found on the readme. Edited October 2, 2022 by dashlet 0 Share this post Link to post
Biodegradable Posted September 15, 2022 A curious first map for sure. Doubly curious to see more ;^) 1 Share this post Link to post
dashlet Posted September 15, 2022 (edited) @Biodegradable Nice playthrough. Thank you for also providing commentary, reactions are important to hear! About the kills you miss.... Spoiler They are on a secret fight, that why you also missed one secret (You have to shoot a switch throught the "windows" on the pilars room to reveal a teleporter) Edited October 2, 2022 by dashlet 1 Share this post Link to post
Lhyntel Posted October 1, 2022 (edited) As @dashlet said, I wanted to thank all of you for the nice feedback this project has received! While this is our first contribution to the Doom community, we want to give our best shot at creating something you can enjoy playing. One thing I wanted to mention is that as my friend did, as soon as I officially finish my first map I'm doing, I will be posting it here, so expect news soon! Edited October 1, 2022 by Lhyntel 1 Share this post Link to post
dashlet Posted October 2, 2022 (edited) I'll like to do a little uptade about the status of the project. So far MAP01 its completly done and polished, and MAP02 and MAP03 are almost finished. We are having a lot of fun doing this project and mapping in general. As Lhyntel said, MAP02 its coming out soon and it mostly done by him (I only helped by provinding one particular fun fight). After that, no more demos will be available (Sorry) I also received some messages and a lot of positive feedback from the community (How to not expect such things from this amazing community). I also got the chance to participate on the Doom Urbex Community Project, which help me a lot to not get burn out with the liminal space aesthetic. Anyways as always, here you have the picture of the day. Spoiler As a last note, we decided to change the name of the wad from Liminal World to Liminal Doom (It just sounds 10 times better despise being generic) And as always, thank you for reading! 2 Share this post Link to post
Biz! Posted October 2, 2022 I enjoyed the first map, the only problem I have with it is I get crammed and can't escape from Archviles and other devious demons, I think I would be better at preventing this if I didn't stop playing doom for a while, but I did enjoy the map. 1 Share this post Link to post
ryiron Posted October 3, 2022 I hadn't heard of liminal spaces before, but I really like the aesthetic of this map. The weird half real, half twisted and surreal environments are very cool. Combat is good too: some fun and tricky close quarters encounters, and good variety. The fight past the three coloured door feels a little bit rng based. I think the strategy is to rocket down one of the viles before stuff starts spawning in so that you can safely stay over one side of the room, but it's hard to do consistently. I also got wedged on the bars blocking the entry door and tanked a double zap. I like the secret fight, which forces you to use the shadows to work and some guesswork to keep track of the monsters. The shoot switch and the bars are a bit odd here though. An alternative could be to have the enemies facing you with an invisible wall that lowers when you press the switch. Then you don't need the bars and the player doesn't have to switch weapons. The final fight is, unfortunately, a bit boring. I think its too risky to try to get the cyber in-fighting the pinkies and there is more than enough cell ammo, so the strategy seems to be just plasma spam and then play peek-a-boo with the cyber. It's a bit slow and tedious gunning him down at the end. 1 Share this post Link to post
dashlet Posted October 3, 2022 (edited) @openxt Thank you for playing! Yeah i made the map with the idea of the player facing a lot of close quarter encounters. @ryiron Thank you for providing feedback and playing the map, i especially liked the secret fight tip! I know the final fight can be tedious but i didn't plan to make it really hard or memorable, i'll see if i can make it more exciting. The three coloured door fight can be tricky for blind playthroughs, but if you practice enough, you soon will find out how to beat it consistently. Edited October 3, 2022 by dashlet 1 Share this post Link to post
Wadmodder Shalton Posted November 6, 2022 On 9/12/2022 at 2:03 PM, dashlet said: Anyways as a gift i have today for you some screenshots of the map im currently working on. This are some very early sneak peaks, but im already proud of what i got so far. Reveal hidden contents Off topic, but the first screenshot of MAP02 (if it is that level) kinda reminds me of that strip club from the Duke Nukem Forever E3 1998 trailer that appeared for a couple of seconds, mainly the way the layout of it looks. 1 Share this post Link to post
dashlet Posted December 10, 2022 (edited) Quick uptade. Sorry for not posting the MAP02 demo, but we were very busy lately with other problems and also working on another future project. MAP02 and 03 are completely done, so we are currently working on MAP04 and MAP05. We also decided to discard MAP06 for various reasons, mainly because we think it doesn't fit the liminal aesthetic very well. We are trying our best to give the community a good impression of our first wad, and so far we are very proud of how its turning to be. As always, here are some screenshots. Spoiler MAP02: "Am I Dreaming?" (Based on the famous dream pools) MAP03: "Nostalgia" (Based on kids party rooms and anything like that) MAP05: "Lost In The Mall" (Based on abandoned malls, etc) Edited January 22, 2023 by dashlet 5 Share this post Link to post
dashlet Posted January 22, 2023 (edited) RC1 coming out soon! Edited January 23, 2023 by dashlet 5 Share this post Link to post
dashlet Posted February 2, 2023 (edited) Well everybody, RC1 its out! Thank you everybody for supporting and waiting. If you played MAP01 before dont forget to give it a try again, it recieved an uptade 2 Share this post Link to post
lubba127 Posted February 2, 2023 (edited) 13 hours ago, dashlet said: Well everybody, RC1 its out! Thank you everybody for supporting and waiting. If you played MAP01 before dont forget to give it a try again, it recieved an uptade not sure if it is an issue on my end, but the wad has an error loading with the following message: Bad PNAMES and/or texture directory: PNAMES has 1086 entries, but ALLBLACK wants to use entry 1087. might want to fix that and reupload 1 Share this post Link to post
dashlet Posted February 2, 2023 (edited) @lubba127 Were you using gzdoom? I think i already solved the problem. It was a texture i forgot to remove from the archives. At least for me it works on dsda doom and prboom plus, and i also make sure it worked on gzdoom. Theres probably more weird stuff happening on gzdoom so please report any anomaly. Edited February 3, 2023 by dashlet 1 Share this post Link to post
lubba127 Posted February 2, 2023 3 hours ago, dashlet said: @lubba127 Were you using gzdoom? I think i already solve the problem. It was this texture i forgot to remove from the archives. At least for me it works on dsda doom and prboom plus, and i also make sure it worked on gzdoom. Theres probably more weird stuff happening on gzdoom so please report any anomaly. yeah I'm using GZDoom. I'll be sure to report more stuff back if I find anything especially weird or game breaking. 1 Share this post Link to post
lubba127 Posted February 3, 2023 After playing through the whole wad last night and consulting my partner about how I felt about it, I think I have a semi-coherent review of this map set. Let me start off by saying that you guys hit it out of the park, and I am thoroughly surprised by how you handled the concept, especially after the first two or so maps. I remember following this thread since around the time of its inception. I played through the first map demo, and while it was very well drawn in most places, it left a lot to be desired. I didn’t enjoy the combat that much, and with the style the map went for, I felt it was better to experience with no monsters enabled. After downloading the newest release of the wad, my thoughts remained largely the same. I played MAP01 without enemies, and then re-enabled monsters from MAP02 onward. For those who want to avoid spoilers, I'll leave you with this: PLAY THIS WAD. I was not ready for how good it gets as the levels progress. Kudos to the designers! Spoiler SPOILERS Before I discuss my experiences with the remaining maps, I’d like to digress and talk about the portrayal of liminality in this wad. You see, the first few levels were good, but nothing that would've immersed me or give me that tingly feeling I was searching for. There were misaligned textures, general sloppiness in the level’s construction and detailing, and the combat took away from an experience I felt was at its best when all was quiet for you to enjoy the bizarre scenery. I am very pleased at how wrong I was. Back to discussing the maps, MAP02 felt like a pretty standard Doom II level with some surrealist imagery and music accompanying the gameplay. The big fight for the blue key was definitely the highlight of the level, as nothing else in the level up to that point felt very personal and anxiety inducing. I couldn’t figure out what I was supposed to do to beat the fight, so I resorted to using god mode to finish it. Luckily, I was able to learn about the teleporter on the blue key pillar that lets you telefrag the Archviles, and after that revelation I reloaded my save and beat the fight legit. MAP03 was a step in the right direction, adding more asphyxiating encounters and increasing the subconscious familiarity of the environments. The fights instilled a distinct feeling of anxiety; It wasn't a bad type of anxiety, or at least I don't think. I felt hopeless, like the reward at the end of the crucible I had endured wasn't worth the trouble. Yet I persisted, thanks to my friend, the sunken cost fallacy. MAP03 was almost perfect, however the fight in the soccer field and the final encounter with the Mastermind and Archviles were a little too far above my pay grade. The Spiderdemon fight especially, as I felt the odds of survival were left completely up to chance with the rising and lowering walls. The strategy I tried was to get the Archies to infight with the Mastermind as I danced around the walls without waking up the rest of them by firing shots at the spider. Needless to say, it didn't work, and I think the solution to that combat puzzle is either too cryptic or too precise. Maybe I just need to git gud. MAP04 was phenomenal! The fights weren’t too suffocating or confusing, the design and atmosphere of the level conveyed a feeling of dread, and the secrets were rewarding to figure out. One thing I’d like to point out though: is the intended progression after acquiring the blue key supposed to be strafe-jumping to the hallway exit with the blue key door? Because the steps at the bottom never rise, and I couldn’t find a switch to press so they would rise. I just jumped from the second level of the “foyer” (or whatever it is) onto the floor of the hallway. Alright, onto MAP05. This level is the sole reason why I’d recommend people play this wad outside of the Doomworld forums. I won’t spoil the experience for others, however I will say that I got lost playing it, And it made my stomach drop. I haven’t been caught off guard by a Doom map like that before, so big props to the two co-authors on providing a unique experience in this map. Overall, I’d say this map set needs more recognition, as you guys have done a great job. The visuals, combat, and atmosphere sharpen tightly as the wad progresses, and the restraint shown by the authors deserves commendation. I am incredibly excited to see what you guys have in store for the future. 2 Share this post Link to post
Not Jabba Posted February 3, 2023 (edited) Played this last night and really enjoyed it. Echoing the poster above me, the children's playhouse, school, and mall (and the endmap) were the ones that nailed the feeling of liminal space, while the first two maps were a bit weaker, which shows that you're both improving quickly and developing your voice as mappers. Surrealism and abandonment are themes of thousands of Doom maps, so it takes some real effort to make a player feel it nowadays, and you've definitely accomplished that. Spoiler The blink-and-you-miss-it creepypasta voodoo doll in map 04 was so great. 4 Share this post Link to post
LadyMistDragon Posted February 3, 2023 Soooooo... I made demos of the first four maps. I initially just wanted to do 3 but after seeing instantly how well-realized the school concept is (and nice musical homage to Hell's Grammar School!) I knew I had to check out the other. The atmosphere is absolutely fantastic of course, as something based on liminal spaces actually should be. The combat, too, mostly strikes that balance between predictable traps and classic jump scares that probe at the Doom player's psychology with the monster used. Pain Elementals are a garbage monster and it felt like you were full aware of that with how they were deployed. Short answer, this is incredible stuff! PS: Your use of "Grove" in "Nostalgia" was shockingly intelligent although perhaps the combat intensity toward the end managed to exceed it.. lmd_ldoom.zip 3 Share this post Link to post
dashlet Posted February 4, 2023 (edited) @lubba127 Thank you so much for playing and providing feedback of your experience with the maps! Im glad that overall you enjoy the wad. I must say, if the difficulty of the maps its bothering you than try another difficulty setting, Ultra Violence can be challenging or annoying to some players to a certain degreee, thats why we care about implementing difficulty settings. We knew from the start that some people may find some maps or rooms not "liminal", beacuse in the end its a very subjective term, but i get what you were trying to said. Regarding what happend on MAP04: Spoiler Thank you for reporting this, it its not the intended way to get up there. Theres a switch behind the archvile on the first room that raises a stair to the room. When RC2 its out, we will had this problem solve. @Not Jabba Thank you for playing and enjoying the set! Its good to see that you got the liminal feel from some of the maps. I know that probably a lot of people will feel the same way when comparing the first two maps to the rest of the wad, but we are still very proud of them and the WAD wouldnt be the same without our first creations. Edited February 4, 2023 by dashlet 2 Share this post Link to post
dashlet Posted February 4, 2023 (edited) @LadyMistDragon Thank you so much for playing and recording a demo! I will see your demo tonight and i will make sure Lhyntel takes notice of it too! Im glad the Pain Elementals didnt bother you too much, i though people who didnt like the monster will hate me for how i used them. From the get go i wanted to use Grove as a track for that map when i was designing it, and although the map gets really intense with combat, for me it fits in a way. Edited February 5, 2023 by dashlet 2 Share this post Link to post
dashlet Posted February 13, 2023 Well everybody the journey its over, Liminal Doom its finally on idgames since it seem to not have any major breaking bugs or problems. Thank you everybody for supporting us, we really appreciate the feedback this community had given us. For now Lhyntel and i will focus on or own personal works but we have plans to release something together again in the future (Personally, i have a lot of other mapsets i need to finish). As always, thank you for taking your time to read this! 5 Share this post Link to post
Lt.Gonflette Posted February 14, 2023 Liminal Doom scratches the "short WAD itch" very nicely. It gets straight to the point and portrays the feeling of liminality you'd get from going to such places (or by proxy through pictures) really well with those undulating props and hallways, almost-sensical-but-not-quite architecture, and the appropriately selected, atmospheric soundtrack. The monster arenas are just as devious as they are ingenious, and the Arch-viles in particular are used extremely well here, forcing you to dodge your way through packed crowds in small areas, while tanking fireballs, keeping your finger clamped on the trigger and getting behind what little cover there is before being blasted by Arch fire. On a particular note (see spoiler): Spoiler boy oh boy it took me about a dozen tries to get past the Spider Mastermind in MAP03 on UV! That survival encounter was a truly innovative puzzle, the likes of which I don't remember seeing in any other non-TC WAD I've played. Oh, and the ending: Spoiler that final level where you're just alone in half of your room, staring into the darkness, with nothing to do... kinda made me uncomfortable. During the few minutes I spent trying to find a hidden switch, I felt... lonely. Trapped. There was nowhere to go to, not even a bedroom where I could pretend to go to sleep. I was stuck between half a staircase, half a living room, and a small kitchen. To be honest, I think the loneliness effect would have been even stronger if there was no music, but the track you chose does fit that map :) Great job dudes! 2 Share this post Link to post
dashlet Posted February 14, 2023 @Lt.Gonflette Thank you for playing and leaving a review of our WAD! Like all mappers, we appreciate this type of comments. Glad you enjoyed it. 1 Share this post Link to post
CBM Posted February 14, 2023 (edited) Nice... does it have endless corridors? In GZDoom you can make those with portals but I am not sure about what features are available in BOOM. EDIT: played the first level and it had some really nice and interesting architecture! Spoiler Wasnt a fan of fighting a cyber with just a SSG though Edited February 14, 2023 by CBM : played map01 3 Share this post Link to post
