Good newcomer/newbie wads?

• Nostalgia
• The DBPs
• Moonblood
• Base ganymede
• Solar Struggle
• Stickney Instalation

4 hours ago, PsychEyeball said:

Hard no. You could make a case for the early episodes and probably up to at least Map 19, but Episode 5 and beyond leave no survivors. I beat Scythe's Fire and Ice twice, yet MAP 23 was such insanity it made me quit the WAD. And even then, things only get harder from there.

It doesn't get much harder, the stretch from 23-25 and 27 is the difficulty peak of the wad. 26/29/30 and especially 28 are actually easier. But yeah, Scythe is much more approachable on the whole.

4 hours ago, PsychEyeball said:

I feel Scythe has a less steep cutoff point for newer players and I could imagine less skilled players making it at least to MAP 28. But they're definitely not gonna "run from it" successfully.  

Run From It is actually fairly lenient on UV provided you're not trying to max it (and even then it's not particularly difficult with the right strategy). Besides, if you're having trouble you can always lower the difficulty which removes some obstacles.

3 hours ago, bioshockfan90 said:

"you HAVE to get the record" DSDA rules

That would be the recently defunct COMPET-N, not DSDA. As an archive DSDA hosts any demo regardless if it's a record or a personal best.

49 minutes ago, Andromeda said:

That would be the recently defunct COMPET-N, not DSDA. As an archive DSDA hosts any demo regardless if it's a record or a personal best.

My bad, that's on me. That's pretty cool, I just have a bit of personal bias from having times for E1-E3 on the Unity boards, it was a fun month or so learning the tricks. Also SR50 is hard and I'm a lightweight, haha.

I put on the DSDA twitch stream a lot when I'm trying to sleep, the stuff those players can do is incredible, far beyond my skillset. 

EDIT: To continue the Scythe discourse, I feel like Scythe (the original) is more representative of the classic era of mapping, whereas 2 requires a bit more of a modern skillset. It really does mark 2 different time periods in mapping history. So I probably should've appended that message with a quote along the lines of "depends on how you want to hone your skillset". On the statement of Scythe being the more approachable one, I'll have to agree but from my eyes of introducing new players to what Doom maps are today, I'd just go with 2.

I think Machete is worth a recommend for that sort of player, provided they want the game to switch from safe fun to more of a "challenge me!" kind of fun - or have heard of Scythe and like the idea, but don't want to deal with Fire and Ice (or worse). The first episode teaches you some core techniques (berserk usage, managing sightlines, partial invisibility usage, monster prioritization, etc) while giving you short, fun maps between "lessons" with a final exam kind of map at the end of the episode. It also has some low impact-ish slaughter-y encounters too, which will teach some skills other WADs might expect you to have.

I don't think anyone who's fresh off Doom 2 can beat Scythe 1 or 2, but in Machete? I personally think they stand a fair chance, as the difficulty's acceleration is much gentler and by the end, it's not as brutal as either.

The secret-hiding doesn't seem too far from vanilla either, at least in earlier episodes.

Now if you just want something nice and easy but fun, Revolution! is a perfect fit. It's not hard at all and the maps are made to be blazed through, but it does dabble in oldschool doomcute. Make sure you get the MIDI pack too.

3 minutes ago, Matt Eldrydge said:

Machete, Revolution

I'm playing Machete right now and I definitely think it leans into more of that newschool playstyle (which, duh, makes sense) but I agree that it maintains that old-school compact feel. So big ups there, I think you're onto something.

Revolution is great! All Thomas Van Der Velden works (and valkiriforce for that matter) are pretty approachable. I'd throw Alexander S. (Eternal) in there too.

Not sure if its an IWAD or not but I'd recommend No Rest For The Living. It's a nice step up in difficulty compared to DooM 2 without going tooo balls to the wall like Plutonia.

40 minutes ago, bioshockfan90 said:

I'm playing Machete right now and I definitely think it leans into more of that newschool playstyle (which, duh, makes sense) but I agree that it maintains that old-school compact feel. So big ups there, I think you're onto something.

 

Revolution is great! All Thomas Van Der Velden works (and valkiriforce for that matter) are pretty approachable. I'd throw Alexander S. (Eternal) in there too.

Agreed! Thomas also has TV1998, which is a pinch meaner than Revolution and doesn't seem to be brought up whenever his work is mentioned.

Adding to the Russian suggestions, I think Kuchitsu is a great little episode but just about anything Memfis made is worth a look for newbies. I do wish his catalogue was more small episodes than scattered map 01s for WADs that never were. :P

1 hour ago, Matt Eldrydge said:

I think Machete is worth a recommend for that sort of player, provided they want the game to switch from safe fun to more of a "challenge me!" kind of fun - or have heard of Scythe and like the idea, but don't want to deal with Fire and Ice (or worse). The first episode teaches you some core techniques (berserk usage, managing sightlines, partial invisibility usage, monster prioritization, etc) while giving you short, fun maps between "lessons" with a final exam kind of map at the end of the episode. It also has some low impact-ish slaughter-y encounters too, which will teach some skills other WADs might expect you to have.

 

I don't think anyone who's fresh off Doom 2 can beat Scythe 1 or 2, but in Machete? I personally think they stand a fair chance, as the difficulty's acceleration is much gentler and by the end, it's not as brutal as either.

 

The secret-hiding doesn't seem too far from vanilla either, at least in earlier episodes.

 

Now if you just want something nice and easy but fun, Revolution! is a perfect fit. It's not hard at all and the maps are made to be blazed through, but it does dabble in oldschool doomcute. Make sure you get the MIDI pack too.

Nice post! I'm using the list from xvertigox from the start of the easiest doom, fava beans, doom2, tnt and now ganymede but not sure if I've learnt a thing or two from theses ones mmh

On 1/7/2024 at 6:29 PM, Deadwing said:

Some that I thought look more accessible:

 

- 25 Years on Earth (Doom 2)

- Deathless (Doom)

- Mass Extinction

- Lost Civilization

- Back to Saturn X Ep 1

 

For GZDoom wads:

 

- Neodoom

Apologies for disagreeing but I wouldn't call Mass Extinction a beginner friendly wad at all - Monti has some really tight levels where a failure to do excellent rad suit and ammo management will put you out of commission very fast. Plus there were some maps where you had to punch an arch-vile and fight 3 cybers at once if I recall correctly. 100% agree with Deathless though.

Thank you for all the replies and a fruitful discussion! This thread gets me inspired to attempt to do one of those "SO YOU WANNA PLAY SOME FUCKING DOOM..." pics for 2024, although there is an overwhelming amount of stuff to consider. But now I'll know what to recommend to people when I force them to play classic Doom!

I don't recommend Scythe and especially not Scythe 2 for a beginner at all lol. That said Scythe X is only 10 maps and since the later, more difficult, maps for Scythe X were never made, it is an easy recommendation for a new player.

Other accessible recommendations:

• Lunatic (last map is kind of slaughter-lite, but nothing difficult)
• Vanguard (has some slaughter-lite moments, but nothing difficult)
• Machete (despite inspired by Scythe 1 & 2, it never goes too crazy on difficulty)
• Doom Zero (fairly easygoing wad on par with TNT Evilution on difficulty I would say)
• Anomaly Report (another fairly easygoing wad around or slightly above TNT Evilution)
• Deathless (Fairly easy Doom 1 megawad that is above the first 3 episodes, but below Thy Flesh Consumed)
• Jenesis (Boom wad that is roughly around Plutonia difficulty)

Nice suggestions, I managed to finish episode 2 of base ganymede with a couple of deaths and now I feel the spike in difficulty within the e3m1 start.

10 hours ago, MoiraHeart said:

Thank you for all the replies and a fruitful discussion! This thread gets me inspired to attempt to do one of those "SO YOU WANNA PLAY SOME FUCKING DOOM..." pics for 2024, although there is an overwhelming amount of stuff to consider. But now I'll know what to recommend to people when I force them to play classic Doom!

Thanks for opening this topic, to me it's about broader questions on what exactly constitutes difficulty. The laziest answer for newbie wads is "90% of wads on ITYTD". I don't find this satisfactory because I'm working with the assumption that people want to play on UV or at least HMP, and possibly get a feel for how much the game changes with pistol starts. Pistol start vs continuous is another interesting dimension of difficulty worth reflecting on.

Lastly I think that recommendations also have to take into account the fact that some wads do not have a smooth difficulty curve and sometimes make pretty noticeable upward jumps. For instance, I find that Jimmy goes pretty hard in the last stretch of Jenesis despite an overall accessible curve. I would still recommend it to someone new to classic Doom, but I would also do my best to specify when and how things could slip out of their comfort zone.